Episode 79
Reading the Room: Jana's Boundary-Setting Journey with Long COVID
In this conversation, I sit down with Jana G. (known as Janaandbooks or Lady Whistle Threads across social media) to discuss something we rarely talk about openly - setting boundaries while living with chronic illness.
Jana shares her journey with long COVID and ME/CFS, offering a glimpse into the reality of navigating life with limited energy reserves. We dive deep into the challenges of graduated exercise therapy, the frustration of post-exertional malaise (PEM), and the practical ways she's learned to create boundaries that protect her wellbeing.
This episode is especially valuable for anyone living with chronic illness, long COVID, ME/CFS, or supporting someone who does. We discuss:
- The sudden impact of long COVID on Jana's teaching career and daily life
- How Jana transitioned from teaching to book content creation as her health changed
- The reality of energy pacing and setting boundaries without explanation or apology
- Why conventional medical advice can sometimes make chronic illness worse
- Practical examples of setting boundaries in work and life with chronic illness
- The uncertainty of planning for the future with a fluctuating condition
For those struggling with similar challenges, Jana recommends The Long COVID Survival Guide, which provided critical guidance when medical help wasn't available. This resource helped her understand the importance of rest in managing her condition.
Connect with Jana:
- Instagram, TikTok, and Threads: @janaandbooks
- Subscribe to her newsletter: Lady Whistle Threads (free and paid tiers available)
Resources mentioned:
- ME Action Network - Information and advocacy for ME/CFS patients
Links
Joyful Support Movement Podcasts
Mentioned in this episode:
Buoy Hydration
Transcript
Foreign welcome to Sharing the Middle, where we share the messy middles of life.
Speaker A:I am Lecy, your friend in the middle and guide whose claim to fame this week is sending her first grader off to school.
Speaker A:I'm so excited for him.
Speaker A:I'm so excited for all of us.
Speaker A:I'm also so excited for this episode.
Speaker A:As usual, I'm talking to Jana and books or Lady Whistle threads, depending on where you are on social media.
Speaker A:You'll hear us talk a little bit about how we connected.
Speaker A:But the main reason why I wanted to talk to Jana is because she is a fellow chronic illness individual and really one of the only people that I've heard talk about figuring out how to live life with chronic illness.
Speaker A:And she's only done it a little bit, so I'm really glad that she and I got to talk about it a little bit more in depth in today's episode.
Speaker A:I do want to acknowledge that people have some strong feelings about Lady Whistle threads and all that stuff.
Speaker A:We don't really talk about it.
Speaker A:We don't litigate that in this episode.
Speaker A:I don't really feel like that's my place to do either because I'm tangential to the book content creation community and whatnot.
Speaker A:Just want to preface that before we jump in.
Speaker A:I adore Jana and the conversation that we had.
Speaker A:I'm so glad that she and I had it for me personally, but also because we talk about a lot of the realities of living with Long Covid or me cfs that really make no sense.
Speaker A:And we know it makes no sense, but to hear somebody else go through it is so validating.
Speaker A:I really hope that you enjoy today's episode as much as I did.
Speaker A:Let's jump right in.
Speaker A:It's so nice to welcome you to Sharing the Middle.
Speaker A:You're my first guest postpartum and there's a baby sleeping who may wake up.
Speaker A:Who knows.
Speaker A:We're all on the edge of our seats, you and I.
Speaker A:It's really interesting because you rose to fame, I guess I can say, after I started following you on TikTok, which I know isn't like your main platform, but you on TikTok and then transitioned over to Thread or to Instagram and then to Threads and it's just been so fascinating to see.
Speaker A:You are in the book talk Instagram threads realm and I like to dabble in that.
Speaker A:It's a little bit of an intimidating space to me.
Speaker A:You've rose to, I'll say, prominence with your Lady Whistle threads.
Speaker A:That has exploded very quickly.
Speaker A:I know you And I have connected.
Speaker A:But I would love for you to introduce yourself and then we'll jump in more.
Speaker B:Hi, I'm Jana, or Jana and books pretty much everywhere.
Speaker B:And I am a book content creator who's also living with Long Covid.
Speaker A:And that's why I started following you is because as a me CFS girly, we have a lot in common.
Speaker B:And that's also part of my diagnosis is ME cfs.
Speaker B:So we share that.
Speaker A:I got sick in a time where people were like, well is it Covid?
Speaker A:I'm like, no, it wasn't Covid.
Speaker A:I took many a test, but I have a lot of the same things as people with Long Covid.
Speaker A: in the beginning of September: Speaker B:That's exactly what happened to me at like this same time.
Speaker B:So I got Covid at the end of July.
Speaker B:So it's been exactly three years.
Speaker B:And then in September is where things took a turn.
Speaker B:Cuz I was also a teacher so I was trying to go back to work and that's when it really hit me.
Speaker B:So all August we thought I was like, okay, I was just a little tired after big hangouts.
Speaker B:And then the day I tried to set up my classroom, I was like this.
Speaker B:Maybe it was just really hot in this room, but it was downhill really quickly.
Speaker B:It was really scary to hear, sorry.
Speaker A:My heart is beating because I'm like, oh my gosh, that's so similar to what it got better.
Speaker A:And then just these moments kept happening of what is wrong with me.
Speaker A:And then one morning there was one night where it hit me.
Speaker A: It was Halloween of: Speaker A:I didn't go trick or treating with my kids.
Speaker A:My mom and dad and my husband took my kids cuz I knew I wouldn't be able to make it.
Speaker A:It's almost like my brain and body clicked at that moment.
Speaker A:And the next day I couldn't lift my arms, my body was so exhausted.
Speaker B:It's a crazy.
Speaker B:I don't think I've talked to anyone else who's had it as like severely as me.
Speaker B:I've talked to a couple people, but of course like when you have chronic fatigue, like you don't have the energy.
Speaker A:No.
Speaker B:To talk through it with anyone.
Speaker A:I hope it's not too you're coming to us from your bed.
Speaker A:To which I said please do.
Speaker A:I've recorded many a podcast in my bed because this is.
Speaker A:I've set up my life to be able to do this.
Speaker A:I'm not in my bed right now, but it's become my outlet.
Speaker A:Before we get into all that, you were a teacher and now you're in the book content creation space.
Speaker A:Were you in that space pre illness?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So I started my Bookstagram is where I started.
Speaker B: t in, I think March, April of: Speaker B:So I was a teacher and then transitioned to Zoom school and my area stayed online for about a year.
Speaker B:And so some teachers went back in person and some kids chose to stay online.
Speaker B:So a couple of us stayed home.
Speaker B:I stayed home, all of my friends went back in the classroom and I was like, what am I?
Speaker B:Who am I going to talk to?
Speaker B:My husband was home.
Speaker B:So I wasn't completely isolated, but all I was posting on my Instagram all pandemic long was books anyway, so I was like, I literally just googled, I was like, how to start a bookstagram.
Speaker B:So that became a good part of my life.
Speaker B: did go back in person for the: Speaker B:And I kept up my bookstagram and made some really good friends.
Speaker B:And then when I got sick, it was just my outlet.
Speaker B:It was the only way I was really connecting to people.
Speaker B:It was, you know, my whole community.
Speaker B:So I'm really thankful for this space of, of bookstagram and book talk and now book threads.
Speaker B:It definitely gives me something to do when, like we said, I am in bed for most of the day.
Speaker B:I'm only able to be out of bed for about two to four hours a day.
Speaker A:I'm gonna ask lots more questions about that.
Speaker A:But before we get into that, one of my first questions, I'd like to get an essence of your reaction to the concept of the middle.
Speaker A:I know we talk about the mess, this is about the masculine middles and sharing our middles, but I find people tend to have a very visceral, oh, that's what this means for me.
Speaker A:So what does that mean for you?
Speaker B:I think I have maybe a less visceral response than a lot of people, but I think for me, I am a pretty present minded person.
Speaker B:And so sometimes even like recognizing that I'm in a middle takes me some time to be able to reflect back on that past.
Speaker B:Because being in I, I view I guess the middle as like a moment of transition often.
Speaker B:And so it can be growth, it can be change, it can be so many things, but it takes me a little while to get through it before I can kind of reflect and see.
Speaker B:Like that was.
Speaker B:That was My transition.
Speaker B:And now that I've come to a new place, how you said that, because.
Speaker A:As you were talking, I'm like, oh, this is an insight.
Speaker A:Your orientation.
Speaker A:You said, I'm a very present person, so I'm a very future person.
Speaker A:My brain is always wanting to run to the future.
Speaker A:And I know a lot of people who are very past oriented.
Speaker A:And I can see how my feelings about the middle when it comes to being future oriented are so frustrating.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Because I'm stuck here and I want to be there.
Speaker A:And people who are very past oriented are stuck in the past and they're here.
Speaker A:So I think that yours is a very healthy.
Speaker B:I think it's really been a blessing because I can focus on just what I'm experiencing in the moment and the things that are working in the moment.
Speaker B:And I definitely am a planner.
Speaker B:So I definitely think of the future.
Speaker B:But it does, like, I have to kind of think about it.
Speaker B:It's not where my brain naturally lives.
Speaker B:But like you said, it is so frustrating to be in a moment of transition or a.
Speaker B:A difficult spot and be like, but I want to be there.
Speaker B:And how am I ever gonna get there from here?
Speaker A:And that's the middle really came from my frustration with my chronic illness of this, like, I'm stuck and I can't do anything.
Speaker A:And then I started looking around and seeing other ways that I was in the middle.
Speaker A:And it was driving me bananas and haunted me essentially for about a year of my life.
Speaker A:Wow.
Speaker A:But now I like talking about people's messy middles because they get what that looks like.
Speaker A:I do wanna step back.
Speaker A:Do you want to talk about your long Covid as your middle or is else you would want to talk about?
Speaker B:That was definitely what I was thinking about.
Speaker B: I got Covid In July of: Speaker B:And that's when I went on my leave of absence from work, from teaching.
Speaker B:And then I had to do like a really intense month of bed rest.
Speaker B:And the only reason I even knew to do that was because I read a book called the Long Covid Survival Guide.
Speaker B:Because none of my doctors had any idea what to do.
Speaker B: get me in until September of: Speaker B:So a year after I got sick.
Speaker B:So I was just.
Speaker B:Thank goodness for the book telling me to rest.
Speaker B:Cause otherwise I don't know what I would have done.
Speaker A:I just had a big moment of jealousy.
Speaker A:Then I'm like, wait, you started in July and You got a diagnosis by September, middle of September?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Well, I was really impacted.
Speaker B:I could not go to work.
Speaker B:Yeah, I would within like an hour of being out of bed, I would be shaking and feel like I was going to.
Speaker B:I didn't feel like I was going to pass out.
Speaker B:My doctors are debating if I also have pots.
Speaker B:And so the way I was describing, I was like, I feel like I'm going to collapse.
Speaker B:I feel like my body, if I don't sit down, it's going to sit down for me or lay down specifically.
Speaker B:And so it was just.
Speaker B:It was so intense.
Speaker B:And very fortunately, I live in an area that's very focused on long Covid and researching it.
Speaker B:And so it took about two months, but I was able to get a diagnosis.
Speaker A:That's awesome.
Speaker A:With an ME CFS diagnosis, you can't even get diagnosed until you've been in it for six months.
Speaker A:So I'm just like, woo.
Speaker A:I'm so excited for you that you've had those two, like, levels of support.
Speaker A:It just makes me feel good that someone had that.
Speaker B:I started physical therapy after getting in with the U dub specialist near me for long Covid.
Speaker B: And So we started December: Speaker B:Everyone was like, this is going to change your life.
Speaker B:This is gonna get you back on track.
Speaker B:This is gonna get you back to teaching.
Speaker B:And I was excited, but I was also really nervous because right now I said, I can be out of bed for about an hour or two at a time for like two to four hours a day.
Speaker B:At that time, I was only able to be out of bed for about 20 minutes at a time for maybe an hour a day total.
Speaker B:And so I was like, how am I going to get.
Speaker B:Get to physical therapy and then do physical therapy for an hour twice a week?
Speaker B:But it was very gentle.
Speaker B:I got to lay down a lot.
Speaker B:It was definitely made for someone with the issues I was having.
Speaker B:And then I progressed really, really quickly.
Speaker B:So by January, we had me doing like, light activity around the house for like 20 or 30 minutes a day.
Speaker B:I was experiencing some crashes, so I would be like, up and doing an activity and that wave of exhaustion where it just feels like every bit of your energy has been sucked from your body.
Speaker B:Would hit me, but then I would lay down, I would have a, you know, electrolyte drink, and within an hour I'd feel fine.
Speaker B:So we thought it was okay.
Speaker A:Have you seen Hercules, the Disney animated film?
Speaker A:Hercules?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:You know, the moment where Hercules and Hades, at the end, they shake hands And Hercules loses all of his strength.
Speaker A:That is what I tell my husband.
Speaker A:It feels like when I.
Speaker A:Because I have those moments too, of it feels like all.
Speaker A:And so like Hercules, in that moment, he like, because he loses all of his strength.
Speaker A:And I'm like, that's what it is.
Speaker A:Like we were watching it with my son.
Speaker A:I was in the midst of things like Joe, that's it.
Speaker A:That's what he looks like.
Speaker B:So to hear you, that's a perfect explanation.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:It's always so hard to describe to people until you feel it, because they're.
Speaker A:Like, I'm tired too.
Speaker A:I'm like, no, you don't do it.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:I'm like, yeah, I get.
Speaker B:I get that tired.
Speaker B:But this is a whole like.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:I've always described it to people as maybe having mono.
Speaker B:I had mono.
Speaker B:I was able to open a play like a week later.
Speaker B:So I was not as impacted as this is.
Speaker A:Mini crashes, kind of, it sounds like.
Speaker A:But then rebounding.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Or we thought I was rebounding.
Speaker B:So then I woke up one day in February and it was the big crash.
Speaker B:So it was.
Speaker B:All of my energy was gone and it was not coming back.
Speaker B:It was not an hour later.
Speaker B:It didn't matter which of my medications I was taking or how much water and nutrient dense food I was doing, it was gone.
Speaker B:I went back to PT after a couple days, but was like, this isn't good.
Speaker B:And so we did like yoga level.
Speaker B:We were mostly breathing and doing some stretches, but it just, it wouldn't come back.
Speaker B:So I would go to physical therapy on Monday.
Speaker B:And even though we were being so, so gentle, I wouldn't be able to do anything, anything until I started finally feeling better.
Speaker B:And then it was time to go back to physical therapy.
Speaker B:So then we went down to like one day a week.
Speaker B:Physical therapy at this point had been about a month.
Speaker B:So they were starting to try to like, push me to add a little bit.
Speaker B:And my doctor was like, not my long Covid doctor, my naturopath that I've worked with for longer.
Speaker B:She was like, I think you need to go to like half whatever they're trying to make you do, like half or less, like the lowest activity possible.
Speaker B:And even with that, it would be like I would be able to rally on Monday and then the rest of the week.
Speaker B:I couldn't really rally again until the next Monday.
Speaker B:So I finally decided to quit and do another month of bed rest.
Speaker B:So I was all the way back to the beginning.
Speaker B:And it was just.
Speaker B:It was so frustrating because I can be A little bit of a people pleaser.
Speaker B:And I tend to.
Speaker B:I don't know, like.
Speaker B:I don't want to say, like, bow to authority, but, you know, like, if you're in, like a. I mean, I am a teacher.
Speaker B:When I was in school, I liked my teachers.
Speaker B:I liked to try and do what they wanted me to do.
Speaker B:And so I was kind of in that space where I was like, well, my physical therapists are telling me that this is the right thing to do.
Speaker B:The specialist is saying, this is the thing that's gonna get me back on my feet.
Speaker B:And I want to be back on my feet so badly.
Speaker B:I don't.
Speaker B:I don't wanna give up.
Speaker B:That's how it was framed.
Speaker B:And so fortunately, I also have a therapist, and she was like, you know, Western medicine, their goal is to get you better.
Speaker B:That's what's on their chart, and that's what they're focusing on.
Speaker B:And this is not getting you better.
Speaker B:And they work for you.
Speaker B:So you are allowed at any time to say, this is not working, and you can fire them.
Speaker B:That is, you're allowed to do that.
Speaker B:And so thank God she gave me permission, because otherwise, I don't know if I don't know what I would have ended up doing.
Speaker B:That is where I learned to set boundaries when I feel that badly, because I didn't.
Speaker B:And I didn't.
Speaker B:I just got.
Speaker B:I started getting worse, basically, and it took the month of bed rest to feel better again.
Speaker A:So I just want to pause here and do a little psa.
Speaker A:What Jana is describing is called graduated.
Speaker A:I don't know if it's exercise or what not.
Speaker A:And it is something that people want to tell people with me, CFS or long Covid to do.
Speaker A:And logically, it makes sense, right?
Speaker A:You just increase your movement and your whatnot, and it should raise that threshold level.
Speaker A:I get why people want you to do that, but the reality is that doing that makes you worse.
Speaker A:It is so hard to get somebody to understand that when they're like, but.
Speaker A:But what do you like when you work out?
Speaker A:The more you work out, the better you do.
Speaker A:And if your body has changed to a place where that is not helpful, it's sending you back and back and back.
Speaker B:Called post exertion, malaise.
Speaker B:So there is a pem.
Speaker B:There's a word for it.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I always call it pem.
Speaker B:Is it pem?
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:That's what I say.
Speaker A:I say pem.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:Both.
Speaker B:Both work.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:It just sounds so cute.
Speaker B:It's not cute.
Speaker A:Though it's, it's ruthless.
Speaker A:It's not just fatigue, it's flu like symptoms.
Speaker A:So you feel like you have the flu and it's so unexplainable.
Speaker A:You're like, why is my nose running?
Speaker A:There's so many things about it is so annoying, frustrating.
Speaker A:And the other part of it is it's a real mind blowing thing that a lot of times it happens a day or two after your exertion.
Speaker A:So again, lots of things that would be like you're making it up and it's.
Speaker A:I wish I was like this be so much more.
Speaker B:Yeah, I would love to be making this up.
Speaker B:Imagine how nice my life would be if this was fake and I just read books all day and talked on the Internet and had no terrible symptoms.
Speaker B:But yeah, I agree with the, the mind just difficulty it is because it's also hard when you're trying to do things because you're like, well I feel good right now.
Speaker B:I don't know how I'm gonna feel in two hours, two days, two weeks.
Speaker B:I don't know when it's gonna hit me.
Speaker B:And then when it hits, you're like, well, which thing that I did caused this?
Speaker B:You have to like do this backwards analysis of everything you did.
Speaker B:It's like, you know, energy, pacing, calculus in reverse.
Speaker A:Oh yes.
Speaker A:It's just so nice to talk to.
Speaker B:Somebody who's like funny, but it's not funny.
Speaker A:I know, it's.
Speaker A:It is funny.
Speaker A:It is such a bizarre thing that it is funny.
Speaker A:And there are so many times too where you're looking back and you're like, what was I thinking?
Speaker A:What?
Speaker A:How did I not realize that was gonna be the thing that got me?
Speaker A:And it's cause you were feeling good and you wanted to keep going.
Speaker A:I wanna go back to a little bit piece there.
Speaker A:You said, I, you are a planner, you don't know what's gonna happen.
Speaker A:This.
Speaker A:And that has been one of my biggest struggles.
Speaker A:So I would love to hear about how you deal with that.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's, it's really difficult.
Speaker B:So in like kind of the micro.
Speaker B:The planner aspect is helpful.
Speaker B:I got one of those planners that, you know, you can list out your whole day by the hour and I would use that to set up my pacing plan of what I could do.
Speaker B:And so on a micro daily level, it's really helpful to look at what I'm able to do each day.
Speaker B:But on like the macro, like 5, 10 year plan in 5 years, am I going to be able to be out of bed for Eight hours a day.
Speaker B:Am I going to be out of bed for four?
Speaker B:Like, am I?
Speaker B:Because with me, cfs, one of the things they say is only about, like, 10 to 25% of people can ever add time.
Speaker B:So you have to do this energy pacing.
Speaker B:That's, like, the only thing they've proven can help you, but it's just to find your threshold.
Speaker B:They don't know if you can ever add time.
Speaker B:So, yeah, I'm glad I've been able to add a little bit of time.
Speaker A:Pregnancy and postpartum has given me so much more time at where I'm at.
Speaker A:And I. I've joined a Facebook group about.
Speaker A:With me, CFS or pregnancy Parenting.
Speaker A:And this is something that's really common, is that either during pregnancy or when you're breastfeeding, you, you feel better.
Speaker A:And so right now, I'm on this.
Speaker B:Like, that's so interesting.
Speaker A:I have felt better than I have in three years in my own borrowed time.
Speaker A:Like you were saying, like, in five years, I'm like, I could be better, it could be worse.
Speaker A:I could have raised my threshold.
Speaker A:Or by the time I get out of this, my threshold's gone.
Speaker A:My.
Speaker A:My.
Speaker A:My husband's.
Speaker A:Can you just breastfeed forever?
Speaker A:And we'll sell the milk and, like, I don't think it works.
Speaker B:Like, maybe.
Speaker B:But I've been so fascinated to watch that part of your story because I was.
Speaker B:We were prepping to start IVF when I got sick.
Speaker B:So we had been trying to get pregnant for three years.
Speaker B:And that's my big question, is, am I ever going to be able to do that?
Speaker B:Because at this point, I can barely take care of myself.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:I can't take care of an infant.
Speaker B:So what would that.
Speaker A:It is.
Speaker A:I. I couldn't.
Speaker A:I know you've probably heard me say this.
Speaker A:If this is something you've been interesting.
Speaker A:My husband and I didn't plan to have any more kids.
Speaker A:We felt like it was irresponsible to have more kids because of how I was doing.
Speaker A:I already had two kids that I was struggling with.
Speaker A:My husband is the bomb.
Speaker A:If I had one piece of advice for you, that if your partner is not going to be there to be 50, 50, maybe even more sometimes of a partner, it's not gonna work.
Speaker A:But because my husband is wonderful, we've been able to make it work.
Speaker A:We have lots of family support and that kind of stuff.
Speaker A:And I will say this, Violet, my third child is the biggest gift from the universe that I could ever ask for because I feel better.
Speaker A:I Feel good.
Speaker B:That's amazing.
Speaker A:I've had this gift, and I would have never made this choice because I thought it was gonna be the wrong choice so that I could give you advice.
Speaker A:It's such a gamble.
Speaker A:And that's the thing that's so hard is that literally when I got pregnant because I freaked out, I was like, am I gonna be able to have this baby?
Speaker A:My husband was like, do you feel physically like you're gonna be able to do this?
Speaker A:And I'm like, I don't know.
Speaker A:And I did my research, and literally, you can imagine there's very little research on me.
Speaker A:Cfs, let alone women.
Speaker A:Right with me.
Speaker A:Cfs, let alone pregnant pregnancy, keep niching down.
Speaker A:And I found something that was like, a third of women feel better, third of women feel worse, third of women feel the same.
Speaker A:Literally.
Speaker A:Who knows what could happen?
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Did you feel like because you've.
Speaker B:You've had two other children, were those other pregnancies, like, easier or harder?
Speaker B:Or do you.
Speaker B:Can you compare?
Speaker A:Oh, I can.
Speaker A:So pregnancy, for me, pre.
Speaker A:Being pregnant this time around, I would semi.
Speaker A:CFS was the closest to when I was pregnant because I felt the worst of my life when I was pregnant.
Speaker A:I was sick all the time.
Speaker A:I felt awful.
Speaker A:I got gestational diabetes.
Speaker A:Like, all the little terrible things that go wrong when you're pregnant.
Speaker A:I felt like that this time around, I had all the same things.
Speaker A:I think it did mellow my me CFS out.
Speaker A:That pregnancy was like a normal person's pregnancy, almost interesting.
Speaker A:So for me, it like, came in almost.
Speaker A:Even now that I'm postpartum, I'm like.
Speaker B:Like, that's amazing.
Speaker A:I. I went from what I would probably consider moderate me cfs.
Speaker A:Like, I. I could be out of bed quite a bit, especially right before I got pregnant, to, I would say mild.
Speaker A:Like, my pacing is very gentle.
Speaker A:I can do it very easily and do get myself in trouble.
Speaker A:Oh, did not think about that.
Speaker A:Or lack of sleep at night is definitely going to affect me here.
Speaker B:I feel like when I'm feeling good is usually when I end up crashing because I don't pace as well because I feel good.
Speaker A:Enjoy the moment that you have because you don't get them.
Speaker A:So, yeah, I.
Speaker A:It is so hard to know.
Speaker A:And I am grateful.
Speaker B:I'm certainly not taking your advice.
Speaker B:Oh, no, I'm not making big decisions.
Speaker A:I am so grateful that the universe took out of my hands.
Speaker A:So if anybody ever wants to question it, it's like, hey, I had an iud.
Speaker A:I literally was the Most responsible you could be.
Speaker A:So I'm so grateful for that and that I get to enjoy, like, I'm enjoying being a mom a lot more than I was before.
Speaker A:So there's just a lot of it for me that I'm so thankful for.
Speaker A:But, man, when you said five, 10 years, I have no idea.
Speaker A:And that's why, for me, a quote unquote normal job is still something that I just am like, I don't think I can risk it.
Speaker B:Yeah, I.
Speaker B:One of my hardest moments was, like, officially leaving my teaching contract because they pulled every string they could for me.
Speaker B:So my school district, you're able to take up to two years medical leave.
Speaker B:So that could be after having a child, after whatever caregiving.
Speaker B:It's unpaid, but you can at least, like, get your job back.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And then they were like, well, for every seven years of teaching, you get those two years or you can get like an extra year or something.
Speaker B:So I used my two years, but they were like, well, since you were able to come in and use all your sick leave, you technically worked like two or three months of your eighth year, so we can get you that third year of sick leave.
Speaker B: ome back like, this September: Speaker B:And we had to.
Speaker B:We decided in, like, January, February, just to fully resign.
Speaker B:And because I was so stressed, like, I was, you know, I kept trying to fight for being able to get on my feet.
Speaker B:Even if I could just work half a day or something, I could get back.
Speaker B:And we just had to be like, that's not a reasonable expectation at this time.
Speaker B:And it's not.
Speaker B:It wouldn't be fair to those kids for me to try again.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So I.
Speaker A:That phrase.
Speaker A:It wouldn't be fair, too.
Speaker A:That is a phrase that I use a lot as well.
Speaker A:And I actually really could transition into the thing that made me be like, ooh, I want to talk to her about this is.
Speaker A:So you've got lady Whistle threads, which people have opinions about what to say.
Speaker B:Especially now.
Speaker A:Especially now.
Speaker A:But one of the things that you did that I, as somebody with me, cfs, and knowing your thought process.
Speaker A:So you do it on threads, and then you also have a substack that people can subscribe to.
Speaker A:I don't remember the exact of it.
Speaker A:I don't subscribe to it because I don't have extra income.
Speaker B:But it's free.
Speaker B:You can subscribe for free.
Speaker B:There's also a paid tier.
Speaker A:Yeah, there's a paid tier, but, yeah, I'm subscribed.
Speaker A:The Free tier, but totally fair.
Speaker A:You did refund proactively your paid subscribers when you had a crash.
Speaker A:Correct?
Speaker B:I.
Speaker A:You were in the middle.
Speaker B:I paused my membership.
Speaker A:Paused your membership.
Speaker B:So I didn't, I didn't refund anyone.
Speaker B:But I did say, like, I'm not going to be able to do my subscriber posts, my like, paid posts.
Speaker B:I was like, I definitely can't do it this week.
Speaker B:And if it was just one week of the month, like I kind of told people, I was like, I'm hoping for three posts a month.
Speaker B:That would have been fine.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:But I was getting ready to go out of town, so I was getting ready to do a big energy pacing push to see if I could do an in person hangout for like one hour, which is huge.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So I was like, I definitely can't do next week when I'm pacing for that.
Speaker B:And then the week after I probably am going to be in a crash, to be fully honest.
Speaker B:So I'm like, if I'm not going to be posting for three weeks, I'm not going to be charging people.
Speaker B:That just seems unfair.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So I paused it for that reason.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker A:But it was proactive and I just, I had this moment of, oh, this is boundaries in action.
Speaker A:And I got really excited and so I wanted to hear more of how you come to.
Speaker A:Not necessarily that decision, but it sounds to me like you've really thought about boundaries.
Speaker A:They get challenged as they have very much lately for you.
Speaker A:Yeah, but how?
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:Maybe I'm just like more of like, how do I set them and have been able to do that?
Speaker A:Because that is.
Speaker A:Well, I have a really great therapist.
Speaker B:Is the short answer.
Speaker B:And I had to work with boundaries a lot with her before long.
Speaker B:Covid.
Speaker B:So we have done this work before.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I know things about myself, but I think a lot of the boundaries are also just me.
Speaker B:Me being transparent.
Speaker B:Like me being able to say, I am in a crash and I can't work today gives me permission to rest.
Speaker B:Pausing the subscription and saying this is turned off for three weeks means that I can actually rest and relax because I know that no one's expecting this work from me.
Speaker B:And so that's kind of where the boundaries in a sense come from, is by communicating to someone that this is what I need to do, I then can give myself permission to do it.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Instead of pushing against it because I want to be doing things, I want to feel productive.
Speaker B:I want to, you know, not be just bored and watching Netflix all day.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's one of those things where there you learn a lot about yourself and you learn how much thinking costs you.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:That is one of those big ones.
Speaker B: Up until January: Speaker B:It was.
Speaker B:It was crazy.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And so, like, this conversation we're having right now, I.
Speaker A:Like I said I'm feeling great, I'm doing well.
Speaker A:I'm still gonna have to go lay down for an hour after this, because that kind of stuff, it's gonna be a lot.
Speaker A:And so this is gonna be the.
Speaker B:Only thing I do today.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:I appreciate you.
Speaker B:Thanks.
Speaker B:It's really nice because, like, talking to someone else and, like, doing something that's novel.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Is very good for, like, my brain and my mental health.
Speaker B:But there is a cost.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So to put a little end on your middle would be to ask do you still feel like you're in a middle, or do you feel comfortable in your chronic illness and in long Covid.
Speaker A:Or would you still say that because it sounds like you've got a lot of stuff figured out.
Speaker A:Thank you.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I mean, I think some of the big things I had to come to terms with to be in a place that I feel more okay and less of a messy middle, is that me and my husband both had to face the reality that this could be forever.
Speaker B:This could be my new normal.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And to kind of make peace with that, make peace with us maybe never having kids, me never going back to the classroom, me never going back on stage.
Speaker B:Like, I had so many things.
Speaker B:And so in a weird way, lady whistle Threads was a really good mental thing because I had now a weekly assignment.
Speaker B:I had a job.
Speaker B:I could be taking notes and keeping track of what was going on on threads and then writing about it and chatting with people about it.
Speaker B:And so it kind of feels like I have a job.
Speaker B:But like you said, with getting a normal job, like, this is the threshold of the most I can do is this.
Speaker B:And posting some book reviews on Bookstagram and Booktok TikTok is really, like, almost too hard for my energy often.
Speaker B:So I kind of go back and forth depending on where I'm at and how I'm feeling.
Speaker B:And so I think I could be in a middle.
Speaker B:There could be a stage after this, but maybe there's also, like, another middle, another transition stage that gets me to something else.
Speaker B:And I think for now, I feel like I could be okay with my life looking like this.
Speaker A:So my last question.
Speaker A:Do you have a piece of advice whether that's something you've learned from experience, something you wish someone had told you, or just something that you're like, this is the best advice I've ever gotten.
Speaker B:I think my piece of advice would be that no one has to give you permission to set a boundary.
Speaker B:Your boundary is whatever you personally need in that moment or want in that moment, and you're allowed to just set it and not rationalize it and not explain why you need it.
Speaker B:You can just set it and he'll do it.
Speaker A:That's huge.
Speaker A:The not explain it and not rationalize it.
Speaker A:I'm like, I'm constantly explaining and rationalizing with myself and everybody.
Speaker B:You don't need to defend it.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:That is your boundary and you can just name it and people will fight it.
Speaker A:You've given me permission today for that.
Speaker A:I'm gonna take that and hold onto it.
Speaker A:So much for joining me today.
Speaker B:Thank you for having me.
Speaker B:Lacy.
Speaker A:Where can people find you and that kind of stuff?
Speaker B:Jana and books on Instagram, TikTok and Threads.
Speaker A:Awesome.
Speaker A:And you read all kinds of things.
Speaker B:Mostly romance focused.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Contemporary, historical, and fantasy.
Speaker B:But I do do usually at least one book a month outside of that, whether it's a thriller, historical fiction, or nonfiction.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And you've got lady with Whistle Threads, which is fascinating.
Speaker A:Honestly.
Speaker A:Just a sociological thing to watch where you take all of the discourse about books that's happening on threads and put it all in.
Speaker B:I summarize it in context.
Speaker B:Stupidize it.
Speaker A:Thank you for sharing the middle with me today.
Speaker B:Thank you for having me.
